Episode Summary
Dr. Angela Cleo Smith, sociologist, conflict mediator, restorative justice practitioner, and author, joins Simma for a thoughtful conversation about identity, belonging, and communicating across differences. Growing up biracial (half Black, half white) as the youngest of 13 siblings, Angela learned firsthand what it means to feel like an outsider. Those experiences shaped her work in diversity, equity, inclusion, restorative justice, and creating genuine belonging.
Together they discuss why belonging is the missing piece in DEI, how microaggressions can become harassment, why calling people in is more effective than calling them out, and how discernment helps us respond instead of react. They also explore culture, identity, music, movies, and Angela’s journey to becoming a sociology professor.
What You’ll Learn
• Why belonging is essential for diversity and inclusion to succeed
• The difference between microaggressions and harassment
• How discernment helps improve communication and reduce conflict
• Why asking “What are you?” can be harmful, and better ways to ask about someone’s background
• The value of calling people in rather than calling them out
• How to return conflict without carrying it with you
• Why culture is shaped by lived experience, not just ancestry
Key Takeaways
Belonging matters. Diversity and inclusion create opportunities, but belonging is what makes people feel accepted.
Discernment is powerful. The pause between being triggered and responding allows for thoughtful communication.
Curiosity builds connection. Honest conversations are more effective than assumptions when navigating differences.
What You’ll Hear
• Angela’s experience growing up biracial
• The impact of “othering” on identity and belonging
• What DEI really means and why belonging completes the picture
• Microaggressions versus harassment
• The role of discernment in difficult conversations
• Better ways to ask questions about identity
• Angela’s upcoming book, What Do You Mean By That?
• The “hot potato” approach to conflict resolution
• Music, movies, and personal favorites
Timestamps
00:00 Intro & about the show
02:30 Introducing Dr. Angela Cleo Smith
05:00 Why conversations about race still matter
06:30 Growing up biracial as the youngest of 13 siblings
11:00 Finding belonging across communities
15:30 Building relationships across differences
19:00 Why “I don’t see color” misses the point
21:30 After DEI: Redesigning Belonging Through Communication
28:00 Understanding DEI
33:00 Why belonging matters
36:00 Understanding “othering”
41:00 Culture and identity
46:00 Microaggressions and harassment
51:00 Calling people in vs. calling them out
55:00 Angela’s career journey
1:04:00 Music favorites
1:10:00 Movies and TV
1:13:00 Final advice on discernment and critical listening
1:17:00 Where to find Angela online
Guest Bio
Dr. Angela Smith is an accomplished equity, culture, and leadership expert with extensive experience in driving impactful change across nonprofit, philanthropic, and educational organizations. With a deep
commitment to social justice, Dr. Smith has led initiatives focused on diversity, equity, inclusion, and belonging (DEIB), helping foster environments where individuals and communities can thrive.
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Simma Lieberman, The Inclusionist, helps leaders create inclusive cultures. She is a consultant, speaker, and facilitator. Simma is the creator and host of the podcast, Everyday Conversations on Race.
Contact Simma@SimmaLieberman.com to get more information, book her as a speaker for your next event, help you become a more inclusive leader, or facilitate dialogues across differences.
Go to www.simmalieberman.com and www.raceconvo.com for more information
Simma is a member of and inspired by the global organization IAC (Inclusion Allies Coalition)
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Frank Carbajal on Latino Leadership: From Migrant Farmworker Son to Silicon Valley Voice
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